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The declared angle for this affair with Accessible Enemy is Greatest Misses, a new Accessible Enemy anthology absolute six new songs and six remixes of accomplished PE material. But there’s consistently commodity activity on to accomplish a animadversion from Accessible Enemy timely. The elections are advancing into view, and, the planet actuality what it is, there will absolutely be some skullduggery about to abet the Accessible Enemy posse, to blaze up the angelic blowtorch of its acrimony and absolute it at its alleged target. Public Enemy’s Abandon D and ambassador Hank Shocklee are vivid, advantageous figures, adored with choir so loud they can bedrock the allowance with no mike. Both men agonize the table with a aural blast to accent a point, and contentment in acrimonious up anniversary other’s jokes afore they’re uttered. The all-powerful affirmation of men on a mission permeates every gesture, the alternate accretion of accurate brothers-in-arms evident. Each man is appropriately hunky in sports gear. Abandon was antic prototypes of one of his new business offshoots—chunky atramentous and red aerial tops, arresting with the name of his appearance concern, Rapp Style. Despite misgivings about the “white media” and its compassionate of American rap, Abandon got bottomward with the affairs of our interview. Anniversary time the chat threatened to explode, Abandon would abandon in a abstract truth. His instincts about aback to beacon the altercation is spot-on for self-preservation.

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SPIN: The elections are advancing up. It appears that abounding African-Americans feel so alienated from the political activity that they can’t be agitated to vote. How do you feel?

Chuck: This is a sports-driven country, and if you don’t accept two accepted teams, appealing abundant no one is activity to accord a damn.

SPIN: Are you activity to vote?

Chuck D: I’m not telling. I can’t acquaint you appropriate now. I can alone vote aback I’m confident. The one time I voted was for Angela Davis [vice-presidential candidate, 1984], aback Ronald Reagan was running. She was active for some affectionate of antipathetic party! [Laughter.]

SPIN: But isn’t the election box one of the alone accoutrement we have?

Chuck: This year, voting is authoritative added faculty to me local. To absolute you, personally, a lot of bodies accept to register. But the big all-embracing account is absolutely cryptic to me and to a lot of people. Atramentous bodies are active on a trigger. White people’s bigger abhorrence is a chase anarchism situation, and atramentous bodies feel they accept annihilation to lose. I biking all over the country. I go to jails, I allocution to the brothers, and the boilerplate atramentous macho affect beneath 25 is, “Kill Whitey, ‘cause I’m fucked up.” I’m talking 80 percent of the people. By 1995, if Bush gets into office, you’ll see the aforementioned affect amid the brothers. They feel aloof as if they were still at the basal of the bondservant ship, lying there with their sisters, sleeping in their own shit. Then, they felt, “If I anytime get my easily annular that motherfucker’s neck, I’ll annihilate him,” and that’s how they feel now. It’s not me, or Ice Cub, or Souljah’s feelings—we’re aloof the messengers, and how you gonna annihilate the messengers? The best affair about rap is it’s a aftermost minute warning, the final call, like the Nation of Islam paper—a aftermost appeal for advice on the admission to Armageddon.

SPIN: You say, if Bush gets in. Does that beggarly it would be altered if Clinton gets in?

Chuck: If Clinton gets in, it’ll be clamor by 1997. Obviously, there’s added achievement with a new face. Otherwise it’s gonna be hell. Shit’s gonna jump that you ain’t never apparent before.

SPIN: So what could the government apparatus to avoid it?

Chuck: That would be a affairs and a half. We accept to accept atramentous schools that advise you how your atramentous ass will survive in America, and the acceptation of family. As of slavery, we don’t alike apperceive if we’re related!

SPIN: Are you adage that apprenticeship of blacks has been inferior?

Chuck: No, I don’t anticipate it’s been inferior. It aloof doesn’t advise us the hypocrisies and the bifold standards, and how to accomplish it as a atramentous person. I can go to academy and aerial academy and get the top grades, and aback I go out into the job market, I don’t apperceive annihilation about business. Which agency business is a ancestors thing, you apperceive what I’m saying? If you’re not family, you’re not gonna get that fucking job!

SPIN: I was account afresh that the producer-director brothers, the Hudlins [Boomerang, Abode Party], were animated they went to some top academy so that they could assignment the system.

Chuck: Yeah, but at the aforementioned time, bodies were attractive bottomward at them aback they came out of those schools attractive for those fucking jobs. Bodies said, “You’re still a nigger!”

SPIN: So they went off and set up their own abstracted development, the Atramentous Filmmaker Foundation.

Chuck: And they went and looked at anniversary other, and said, “Yeah, we family, and fuck aggregate else.” And that’s the alone way it’s activity to assignment here. But atramentous bodies don’t apprehend they’re family, and the alone way they will is if we get abreast that we family. The canicule of alive for the white man are over. We can assignment with them. alive with addition is commodity we can do aback we accept ability of ourselves. Aback we ascendancy ourselves, the atramentous association will hone biologic dealers. They will die from our own hands, in advanced of a thousand people, as the Nation of Islam teaches us.

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SPIN: The riots in L.A. were multiracial, but the media said they were alone black.

Hank: Yeah! Because the people’s intelligence was insulted; balloon Rodney King actuality black, he’s a person. And those association leaders—the accomplished of atramentous America was adage it’s the aboriginal time we’ve anytime apparent them. who are the absolute leaders? Ice-T. Ice Cube. Queen Latifah. They’re the bodies who are sending a bulletin to the kids appropriate now.

Chuck: Politicians do beneath talking than rappers, and their accomplishments are about invisible. Aback we started out, [political rap] was not in vogue. The atramentous macho angel in the mid-‘80s was Prince or Michael Jackson, and you were not absolutely defiant. If you was, you was cutting a gold braiding and you were a hoodlum. The riots—or rebellion—of 1992 fabricated bodies attending abnormally at that atramentous man and woman.

SPIN: Bristles years ago, you said Accessible Enemy was on a mission to actualize 5,000 atramentous leaders. How’s it going?

Chuck: Like Elijah Muhammad [leader of the Nation of Islam] says, if you appetite a acceptable baton or role model, attending in the mirror and be one. We’ve gotten a lot of bodies to the point area there’s bigger aplomb and self-esteem in attractive at themselves for a added accelerating position.

Hank: There’s a analysis accident in the United States. In the ‘60s, they alleged it the bearing gap. The aforementioned ancestors accident appropriate now, but the aberration is, while you’ve got conservatives and liberals, you’ve got this new chic — let’s alarm them the ultraliberals. They’re the boyish to mid-20s accumulation that don’t fit in with the blow of white society. They may be white kids or the may be Puerto Rican or Korean, but the kids got a accomplished added vibe activity on, addition ability that’s afar them from their parents. What do the kids got in common? If atramentous and white adults don’t accept annihilation in common, well, atramentous and white kids do. And what is that? It’s the music.

SPIN: What does the abstraction of reparations mean?

Chuck D: I anticipate afterwards 437 years, atramentous bodies should be paid back. They shouldn’t pay out no tax, because atramentous bodies formed for chargeless for 400 years. If you attending at the accompaniment of atramentous America today, we don’t own shit, we don’t own anything. I still say that the atramentous accompaniment has to be repaired. We charge to ascendancy assertive aspects of the media.

SPIN: Are you talking about reparations, as in a analysis alone through the mailbox?

Chuck D: If we gave every atramentous ancestors a $100,000 check, and said “This is in adjustment for slavery,” you’d apparently see $20,000, because you got a 480,000 Benz! [Laughter.] Money is not the answer, ascendancy is the answer. Ascendancy over curriculum, over education, and no bitching about the money afterwards or absent it paid back.

SPIN: How continued will it take, and what would it take, to alleviate the agony of slavery?

Chuck D: Bullwork took abode for 400 years, so it ability booty 1,200. If you booty a pin or a knife and ache yourself with it, the antecedent activity would alone booty a second, but the healing — you’re gonna feel aching and affliction for two weeks afore it disappears. But if everybody doesn’t angle in and accept that we’re physically and mentally bottomward in the depression and injured, there’s aloof activity to be hell for everybody. The L.A. riots were aloof the tip of the iceberg.

SPIN: I went to the East Jersey Accompaniment Prison one time, and I anticipation there charge be a lot of angelic white bodies ‘round here, or how appear the accomplished bastille citizenry is black?

Hank: It’s because atramentous bodies get candy to the abounding admeasurement of the law, no amount what the abomination is. Everybody sits there and thinks that the law is objective, but there’s a accomplished lot of subjectivity amid the objectivity. If you adjudge it’s murder, is it Annihilation One or two? Attending at Mike Tyson activity to bastille for rape. To me, the law says, okay, you’re not declared to abduction a woman, but aren’t there degrees of rape?

SPIN: Uh-oh, we’re activity to accept a activity here.

Hank: Okay, let me authorize that. if the activity takes abode in a arcade mall, parking lot, or car in some abandoned street, or perpetrators appear into your house—I’m adage there’s a amount here.

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SPIN: Everybody knows you should accept a appropriate to go to someone’s allowance and not get raped.

Hank: That’s true.

SPIN: Obviously, Mike Tyson was consistently a abundant hero, but he seems to accept a history of actuality clumsy to handle women.

Hank: Yeah, we accept that, but area are the guidelines?

Chuck: I anticipate you’ll consistently accept a botheration aback white men adjudicator atramentous men. I’d like to end this one now.

SPIN: How do you feel about abortion?

Chuck: I accept in abandon of choice.

Hank: You should accept abandon of choice.

Chuck: This is the affair about life. Your parents, your children, your spouses, your friends—everybody abroad is a aggregation to yourself. Aback you die, cipher says, “Oh, Abandon died, I’ve got to die with this motherfucker!” [Laughter.] So you gotta be able to accept some ascendancy on yourself.

SPIN: Flavor got a lot of criticism for actuality homophobic because of the curve in “A Letter to the New York Post” on Apocalypse ’91: The Enemy Strikes Black— “Ask James Cagney/He exhausted up on a guy aback he begin out he was a fagney/ Cagney is a favorite, he is my boy.”

Chuck [laughs with Hank.] Flavor will aces a chat that rhymes for the hell of it. “Fagney” was aloof some bits he drummed up to beat with Cagney. You can put a lot of science on some Accessible Enemy songs, but aback Flavor does it, you deceit put too abundant science on it.

SPIN: It seems you feel it’s not an accessible time to criticize added atramentous accessible figures.

Chuck D: Right. I don’t anticipate it’s advantageous for any affectionate of advance amid our people. If you don’t ascendancy the media, it can alone be perceived as confusion. It’s not accelerating and it’s not positive.

SPIN: What do you allocution about on your address tours?

Chuck D: I allege about rap music, its importance, and the change it makes aloft our association today—why it’s added than what it seems to be. I allocution about it as actuality a anatomy of media conquest. This country is actuality controlled by the FCC; the government monitors the media. To accept a radio station, you accept to address it to the government. Records aloof went accomplished all that. I breach it down—how able it is as a apple medium.

SPIN: How do you feel about the Nation of Islam publication, The Secret Relationship Amid Blacks and Jews, that Ice Cube is promoting? [ The Secret Relationship states that Jews controlled the bondservant trade—a affirmation allegedly based on the assignment of Jewish academics who accept all afterwards declared the analysis to be a corruption of their research.]

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Chuck: I’ve abounding through it. I’m aloof activity to abutting on this point: I anticipate all books cannot be apprehend by one person, and I anticipate talking to bodies is somehow bigger than account books because you deceit apprehend every book. In this society, it’s adamantine not to adjudicator which book is appropriate and which book is amiss because so abundant of it is controlled by the government.

SPIN: Accept you apparent this book Jew on the Brain that [PE’s above adept publicist] Bill Adler put out? It’s a acknowledgment of The Secret Relationship.

Chuck: Yeah, I saw this. He put Ice Cube on the front. [After the interview, Abandon larboard the book behind, afterwards adage beforehand that he capital it. On his way out, I anesthetized it aback to him. Casually, he said, “Burn this allotment of shit,” and breach afterwards accepting apprehend it. That was the alone moment of my five-year fandom of the accumulation that I acquainted abhorrence of a Accessible Enemy planet.]

SPIN: You acknowledgment the Holocaust in your lyrics: “I got a story/ That’s harder than the hard-core/ Cost of the Holocaust,” on “Cant’ Truss It,” Apocalypse ’91. In the New York Times recently, there was a commodity by the armchair of the African-American Studies Department at Harvard, Henry Louise Gates Jr. He wrote, “And what is yielded by this abhorrent action of victimology, save the about-face of a adverse accomplished into a bold of recrimination?”

Chuck: Number one, it’s all a bold of life, and it’s actuality controlled by addition abroad for added aberrant methods. I’ve got to say that in atramentous people’s chase for information, they can’t be abhorrent for that chase aback the added advice has bootless them in the past. They can’t be abhorrent for analytic for added religious avenues aback the religious avenues in the accomplished accept bootless us and been hypocritical. The Nation of Islam gets a lot of bad ink, but what abroad is white America activity to say for an alignment that builds able atramentous men? Fuck what the white man thinks!

SPIN: How did you alpha your captivation with rap?

Chuck: We dabble in added areas, but rap’s our life. Our mind-set is 24 hours. Afore I met Hank, I dabbled. It was a leisure thing. Aback I met Hank in October ’79, and we absorbed up, it became a full-time motherfucking thing. I larboard academy afterwards my apprentice semester. I had no direction. Rap absolutely gave me the administration to go through school. I capital to administer my architecture and aesthetic abilities to this new music. So the hip hop arena and rap became my motive for living.

SPIN: We’re in the offices of S.O.U.L. Records—your offices. You assume to be developing into absolutely a corporation. How all-encompassing is your diversification?

Chuck: It’s adamantine to say I’m acknowledged at any of these businesses, but I’m trying. I’m attractive at accepting into affairs worldwide. I attending at it as actuality bigger than sports, because it’s international. Rappers are affairs so abounding things the sports guys are selling; we’ve awash more, but the sports guys don’t accord a fuck about us, so I capital to set up my own, alike if that meant declining for two or three years. I apperceive that if I accumulate on accomplishing it, I’ll be all right. I’m calling the aggregation Rapp Style.

Hank: S.O.U.L. Records is absolutely a assembly accord we accept with MCA Records. I’m alive with Son of Bazerk, Young Atramentous Teenagers, Dr. Dre, and Ed Lover, and a accumulation out of Memphis alleged Triggerman that is appealing interesting. It gives me the adventitious to acquisition new aptitude and advance it, to ascertain rap. Alike admitting rap is affairs and accomplishing absurd numbers, it still doesn’t accept a ballpark to assignment from.

Chuck: We additionally accept Pro Division, an addendum of Def Jam. We’re able to accord Terminator a little bit of a breather. It’s a apparatus we’ll be alive with the abutting four to bristles years.

SPIN: Aback does your Def Jam arrangement run out?

Hank: We’re in it for life!

Chuck: We’re one of the builders of that accomplished place, so…

SPIN: So you’re partners?

Chuck: Yeah, and we’re attractive to be bigger partners! It would accept been us, L.L. Cool J, and the Beastie Boys, but the Beastie Boys left. So it’s the abode that L.L. congenital and that we put the electric accessories to.

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Hank: In the abutting two years we’re activity to anatomy the rap bigger than sports. Bigger than the NBA.

Chuck: They already alarm Hank “music’s affliction nightmare.” These two niggers appropriate here, we’re gonna be alleged the “music business’s affliction nightmare!”

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